Comments on: On-going Iraq and Vietnam Parallels http://www.calledtoservevietnam.com/blog/2007/08/18/on-going-iraq-and-vietnam-parallels/ Called to Serve: Stories of the Men and Women Confronted by the Vietnam War Draft Mon, 30 Jan 2012 06:09:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Tom Weiner http://www.calledtoservevietnam.com/blog/2007/08/18/on-going-iraq-and-vietnam-parallels/#comment-25 Tom Weiner Sat, 18 Aug 2007 20:40:29 +0000 http://www.vietnamwardraftstories.com/blog/2007/08/18/on-going-iraq-and-vietnam-parallels/#comment-25 Thanks for reading my post, Diane. Yes, it is quite incredible what people will do out of desperation, loyalty, indebtedness. I am sure part of it - maybe the biggest part - is imagining one's self being in a position where we require someone's loyalty and wanting to increase the likelihood that we will receive it, by having "shown up" for others. It is often a wonderful trait. It only becomes troublesome when it is manipulated as it so clearly is by our military. as well as by gangs, and organizations like the KKK. Look what it led to during Vietnam - abominable atrocities of revenge when buddies were killed. It also often requires dehumanizing the "other" as not only enemy, but also as less than human and therefore giving permission for whatever mistreatment one devises. Time and again I listened as men described the ways in which basic training sought to do just that - encouraging using insulting names like "Gook", hateful, racist chants and any means deemed necessary to create killing machines from otherwise mostly rather mild-mannered men. Such dehunization is definitely part of what allows people to perform acts of torture as our government has endorsed in the name of protecting us! It often seems predicated on fear - of differencs, of being dominated, of change, of whatever our government can drum up to get enough of us to do its bidding, which includes such past absurdities as the "domino theory" and currently features the "axis of evil" rhetoric and the '"terrorists are everywhere" mentality, which enabled Bush to get reelected. So you aksed, "What do we do from here?" and my only response, today at least, is to assst more and more people to take off the blinders, to see there really are no clothes on the emperor, that we are being manipulated by a military -industrtial complex that does not care about us. That means counter-recruitment efforts, organizing to stop the war, writing Congresspeople to let them know we are watching. This is tough work and you've got to be in it for the long haul as you well know as a lifetime activist for a variety of social justice causes. I was deeply moved on a regular basis by those who I interviewed who said that having the blinders come off around the Vietnam War and the draft contributed mightily to a lifetime of fighting for justice. The gains are incremental and one must be fueled even more by the quest than the outcome since it is so unclear what it will be. Thanks again for being my friend, for caring about these matters and for writing about them so thoughtfully. Tom Weiner Thanks for reading my post, Diane. Yes, it is quite incredible what people will do out of desperation, loyalty, indebtedness. I am sure part of it – maybe the biggest part – is imagining one’s self being in a position where we require someone’s loyalty and wanting to increase the likelihood that we will receive it, by having “shown up” for others. It is often a wonderful trait. It only becomes troublesome when it is manipulated as it so clearly is by our military. as well as by gangs, and organizations like the KKK. Look what it led to during Vietnam – abominable atrocities of revenge when buddies were killed. It also often requires dehumanizing the “other” as not only enemy, but also as less than human and therefore giving permission for whatever mistreatment one devises. Time and again I listened as men described the ways in which basic training sought to do just that – encouraging using insulting names like “Gook”, hateful, racist chants and any means deemed necessary to create killing machines from otherwise mostly rather mild-mannered men. Such dehunization is definitely part of what allows people to perform acts of torture as our government has endorsed in the name of protecting us! It often seems predicated on fear – of differencs, of being dominated, of change, of whatever our government can drum up to get enough of us to do its bidding, which includes such past absurdities as the “domino theory” and currently features the
“axis of evil” rhetoric and the ‘”terrorists are everywhere” mentality, which enabled Bush to get reelected.
So you aksed, “What do we do from here?” and my only response, today at least, is to assst more and more people to take off the blinders, to see there really are no clothes on the emperor, that we are being manipulated by a military -industrtial complex that does not care about us. That means counter-recruitment efforts, organizing to stop the war, writing Congresspeople to let them know we are watching. This is tough work and you’ve got to be in it for the long haul as you well know as a lifetime activist for a variety of social justice causes. I was deeply moved on a regular basis by those who I interviewed who said that having the blinders come off around the Vietnam War and the draft contributed mightily to a lifetime of fighting for justice. The gains are incremental and one must be fueled even more by the quest than the outcome since it is so unclear what it will be.
Thanks again for being my friend, for caring about these matters and for writing about them so thoughtfully.
Tom Weiner

]]> By: Diane Clancy http://www.calledtoservevietnam.com/blog/2007/08/18/on-going-iraq-and-vietnam-parallels/#comment-24 Diane Clancy Sat, 18 Aug 2007 17:05:40 +0000 http://www.vietnamwardraftstories.com/blog/2007/08/18/on-going-iraq-and-vietnam-parallels/#comment-24 I don't usually listen to the radio,. but years ago I caught a little bit of a chilling interview with someone who had been part of the Klan. This guy was a working class guy in the south and he and his wife were having financial problems ... KKK people stepped in and helped them. He had felt alone and then he had a community. It was years before he paid attention to what this community was really about - and then he got out and talked about it. I am not saying the armed services are like the KKK, but the idea of loyalty to comrades is strong. I understand it myself very well. They say that is often what draws people into gangs - the sense of family and community. It is heartening that many soldiers are questioning the war ... it is understandable that they might go anyway to support their team (look how nutty people get about sports teams). What do we do from here? ~ Diane Clancy www.dianeclancy.com/blog I don’t usually listen to the radio,. but years ago I caught a little bit of a chilling interview with someone who had been part of the Klan. This guy was a working class guy in the south and he and his wife were having financial problems … KKK people stepped in and helped them. He had felt alone and then he had a community. It was years before he paid attention to what this community was really about – and then he got out and talked about it.

I am not saying the armed services are like the KKK, but the idea of loyalty to comrades is strong. I understand it myself very well. They say that is often what draws people into gangs – the sense of family and community.

It is heartening that many soldiers are questioning the war … it is understandable that they might go anyway to support their team (look how nutty people get about sports teams). What do we do from here?

~ Diane Clancy
http://www.dianeclancy.com/blog

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